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Post by gopher in heat on Mar 12, 2009 0:38:28 GMT -5
...am I the only one who doesn't love Liz?
Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying I hate her. Or even that I don't like her. I just don't think she's the best thing ever. I know a lot of diehard phans really love Liz in P2, and some are even angry at how she's dealt with in P3, but I just don't get it.
To me, she's just another outsider. Like Alchemy, Jennifer, even Tim. She's fine in P2, but I don't care at all that she gets killed off at the very beginning of P3. In fact I kind of prefer that she dies. I say she's an outsider because the way I see it, Phantasm is embodied by four people (crew aside): A. Michael Baldwin, Reggie Bannister, Bill Thornbury, and Angus Scrimm. Anyone else has just been extra. They're like walnuts in chocolate chip cookies--good, but not necessary at all.
So are there any other phans willing to crawl out of the woodwork and back me up on this?
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Post by DustinM on Mar 12, 2009 8:23:11 GMT -5
Not I.
I was very fond of Liz because of all the new characters that were introduced in the sequels, she was the only one I could see fitting nicely into the first film. She wasn't a kid (Tim), or an ex-military bad*ss (Rocky) or an agent of the Tall Man (Jennifer, Alchemy), she was basically the female equivalent of Mike and I dug that.
Would be curious to hear others' thoughts on this.
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Post by postmortem on Mar 12, 2009 8:41:42 GMT -5
I was very fond of Liz's character too when I first read the script. I was so proud of Don for creating such a warm, sympathetic, intelligent female character (so different from the stereotypical airheads of Sally and Suzy. With Liz, female audience members finally had someone with whom they could relate. Also, I liked that Liz had spunk, but wasn't overboard in aggression like Ripley, Sarah Connor, etc. That's why Liz's offhanded death in P3 was so shocking and... well, wrong, to me. Too callous of the Tall Man, perhaps. Maybe it was what negatively colored my attitude towards the rest of that movie too.
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Post by The Never Dead on Mar 12, 2009 8:52:16 GMT -5
she was basically the female equivalent of Mike and I dug that. That's pretty much why I like her quite a bit. That & I think she's gorgeous haha. I don't like how she's killed off in Phantasm III after her & Mike found each other in Phantasm II. They were together for one night, it seemed & on that same night...or earlier in the morning, she was killed off. Although I watched P2 mere hours ago, I can't remember if she said she had been dreaming about Mike for years or not. I believe she did. Her death kind of goes the Hicks & Newt route of Alien 3 but not as tragic since when she dies, she just dies & then isn't mentioned again.
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Post by scubasteve on Mar 13, 2009 2:50:03 GMT -5
I did like her, and I think it was a shame to kill off the character so quickly. When she first appeared, the story took her to be the new person in the films and it was shocking that she is decapitated at the start of number 3. I thought she would have least have lasted til the end of that movie. But that's why Don's such a great director/writer - he just socks you out of nowhere. It is a shame, but it puts you on edge for the rest of the film.
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Post by gopher in heat on Mar 13, 2009 11:37:12 GMT -5
I think I should reiterate that I don't hate Liz, haha. I like her well enough, it's just that I don't see her as an essential Phantasm character by any means. She lasted one film... the same as every single other character aside from the "core four".
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vitaman2007
Sentinel Sphere
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Posts: 698
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Post by vitaman2007 on Mar 13, 2009 17:16:17 GMT -5
I liked Liz.
Especially her hair. ;D
Hot bod too.
A. Michael Baldwin missed out. ;D
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MrsLeGros
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Posts: 350
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Post by MrsLeGros on Mar 13, 2009 19:30:59 GMT -5
i dont like her cuz she put her lips and her mitts on my man
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Post by Natalie on Mar 13, 2009 19:53:25 GMT -5
I agree with Tony. Even though the first Phantasm I saw was (haha, palindrome) part two, and I just had this feeling that Liz, and Alchemy, didn't fit quite right with Mike, Reg, and the Tall Man. I mean, I have no problem with Liz, I just didn't feel her character was essential in the story.
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Post by gopher in heat on Mar 13, 2009 21:47:26 GMT -5
YES! Finally someone who agrees with me! High five Natalie!
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Generator
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Posts: 99
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Post by Generator on Mar 22, 2009 23:37:29 GMT -5
I liked Alchemy a whole lot better.
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Post by 4barrelhemi on Mar 27, 2009 3:59:06 GMT -5
Eh it didn't really bother me one way or another. Liz was good for what she did in P2 but wasn't really needed in P3.
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briggs
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Post by briggs on Mar 30, 2009 20:42:02 GMT -5
Feh, as much as I love the main Phantasm-vet cast, I think just about everyone in the series can add something. Despite not being fully integrated in the phandom/universe, I thought Liz was very significant in PII and it was pretty-much pointless to have her die in III
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